| C6owners :: Forums :: C6 Support :: The Garage |
<< Previous thread | Next thread >>
|
Want to hazard a guess at what's leaking here! ? |
    Please Register to enjoy additional Member Benefits |
| Author | Post | ||
nickyg
 
|
|
||
   Member No: #100
Location: Tyrone |
Hello again everyone! Well, it is an old wives tale that bad luck visits you in 3s! I realised my fan staying on after switch off a couple of weeks ago, I checked and saw coolant expansion tank more or less dry to the bottom.. Hadnt been in her since then but today needed a short run, so added a litre or so of water to bring up to max just to be safe (just water as I was booked for £199 full service next week aswell as aircon and brake fluid service offers and had already decided to tag a full coolant renewal in there too, pretty good rates, and a bit more peace of mind, so why not.. simply haven't the time to get to it myself this year.) Anyway, on my short run, nearly home, what happens?.... a puncture!  You couldn't make it up! I eased home, got one of the original roccastradas out of the shed and changed the wheel. Now, I see copious amounts of liquid leaking. My immediate thought was: that's what I just put into my coolant system, its out again! Leak to be fixed, maybe the water pump, heater block etc. Ho hum. (engine oil colour and exhaust colour are fine, head gasket safe!) The coolant expansion tank was well down to the bottom again. But that got me thinking.. I had no abnormal temperature readouts at any stage, on that run or previously, and a truly bone dry coolant system would surely give me that? But it was orangey and oily!??? Then I thought: Lds. I lowered her, topped her up. A litre and quarter, say. Not an inconsiderable amount. But not uncommon for a c6. Was still undecided if this missing litre was on my drive or simply had went over time. Bear in mind a year ago I replaced the weakest snap clips in the system around the osf and front fogs with good jubilee clips to stop the common slow drip problem. I am a little stumped here tonight! It is oily and orange. But my coolant tank clearly carried orange antifreeze (as it is stained that colour and could see it at the very bottom) , and coolant is also oily to the touch! I can't say it smells sweet, like coolant, though. My only other thought is something that maybe somebody here might have an opinion on.. Could the flat tyre and subsequent change in suspension parameters/data somehow have caused a sudden ejection of lds? Perhaps a sphere problem? They do ingest and expel quantities of lds when misbehaving, I gather.. I have done the full citaerobics: raised, lowered, raised, lowered, full steering locks etc and the level has remained exactly where I left it in the lds tank since topping up: 1/4 (about 8mm) a way up the filling basket. I may take about 5mm of that out to be nearer flush with the bottom of the filling basket. I may just pop to halfords for some orange oat coolant in the morning and top up and watch for leaks from that system. On a side note, I see in faq the mention of blue coolant in the c6. My tank and the residues are most definitely orange/shades of pink and has had full citroen service history. Can anyone else shed any light on their coolant tanks and the actual colour thereof? The citroen part number for coolant comes up as being Glysantin g33 or revkogel. An OAT coolant. Would this contradict that faq? It is the same thing that halfords will sell you for around a tenner. Any and all thoughts welcome, and will keep you posted, especially following the full dealership service. |
||
|
|
|||
C6Dave
|
|
||
   Member No: #1
Location: Northumberland |
Orange and oily? Sounds like it could be a leaking Eoyls tank/pouch |
||
|
|
|
||
|
nickyg
|
|
||
|
Member No: #100
Location: Tyrone |
Thanks for the reply Dave. So, that would be another orangey, oily C6 liquid to add to the equation! I don't think (hope) it's an eolys leak. I can't imagine I'd even have anywhere near a litre of that stuff left to leak, as I'm expecting that will be a top up job for me and lexia sometime soon, at 85k miles. Speaking of lexia, I can't even use that to aid me right now, as the little netbook it's installed on needs a new ribbon cable to the screen! Its just a pity that the cause/effect chain is so muddied, being that I had both added water to the coolant tank and also got a flat in the same ten minute period. These would ordinarily nudge one towards suspecting coolant leak or lds leak, respectively. Ps. Did anyone get a chance to look at their coolant colour? Strange that the faq seems to definitively say it should be blue, but my tank has obviously always held the orangey pink oat stuff, and the citroen part numbers are indeed oat varieties. (google Glysantin g33) Thanks again.. |
||
|
|
|
||
|
nickyg
|
|
||
|
Member No: #100
Location: Tyrone |
I didn't get to halfords for the coolant today as we are partying for Irelands opening Euro match! But I'm leaning more and more towards it being coolant/water and the pump being a likely source. I note the location of the coolant pump being adjacent to the lds reservoir so any spewing will have covered that area profusely. I suppose if I add coolant and have a watch that will tell the tale. If this is so, surely it's a miracle I haven't seen my temperatures rise on the display (possible dodgy sensors?). As mentioned earlier, the sign for me to have a look was the fan being overworked. :-\ In addition, I don't think I would even want to drive the 27 miles to my dealer for my service (and possible new coolant pump etc) out of fear for wrecking gaskets etc! If it is indeed the coolant pump I will tag on the fixed price timing belt offer to my service a year earlier than planned and try and negotiate the pump into that job for the price of the part, as the labour involved crosses over almost exactly with a timing belt change. |
||
|
|
|
||
|
C6Dave
|
|
||
|
Member No: #1
Location: Northumberland |
nickyg wrote ... Ps. Did anyone get a chance to look at their coolant colour? Strange that the faq seems to definitively say it should be blue, but my tank has obviously always held the orangey pink oat stuff, and the citroen part numbers are indeed oat varieties. (google Glysantin g33) Mine is indeed...... pale blue in colour. |
||
|
|
|
||
|
Gobxoy
|
|
||
  Member No: #786
Location: Essex |
nickyg wrote:- Ps. Did anyone get a chance to look at their coolant colour? Strange that the faq seems to definitively say it should be blue, but my tank has obviously always held the orangey pink oat stuff, and the citroen part numbers are indeed oat varieties. (google Glysantin g33) Checked mine it's vey pale orangey/pink. |
||
|
|
|
||
gmerry
|
|
||
 Member No: #21
Location: Scotland |
Mine was blue/green. Exactly the same as the Citroen OEM stuff. Regards G |
||
|
|
|
||
|
nickyg
|
|
||
|
Member No: #100
Location: Tyrone |
Hello again, thanks for the replies! I think we can see that there are differing colours here. I doubt it matters, though. Barring they are mixed. Definitely though, the relevant part numbers, when traced, equal: glysantin g33 or revkogel. These are your more or less standard oat coolants. The halfords stuff I bought is the same colour as the staininng of the tank, which had only ever been filled/topped by citroen dealerships prior to my ownership so that will do for me! Anyway, the latest. I decided to simply add my distilled water to the tank for my next look. Nothing apparent at first, got up to near operating temperature, kept checking the oil colour, exhaust colour/moisture content and for tell tale rainbowing in the water expansion tank. None of this. Good news, I hope, for the vitals of the engine. Then I drew the leak again, so that should finally pinpoint coolant and eliminates LDS. My conclusion is that the previous leakage was coolant/water mix and it did a rather effective job of getting the residual LDS slow leakage of 18 months ago washed out of the nooks and crannies and and on to the ground, hence the texture that seemed just too oily to be coolant alone. Bye the bye, I had remedied that slow LDS leak after removing the bumper and fittting jubilee clips in two weak spots, of which I must post pictures, as there is an an area other than the known one of just below the LDS tank which requires attention (behind drivers foglamp area). I need to get on to a lift with undertray removed, and all cleaned, in order to be more thorough. I can eyeball the water pump, which I suspected, but can't say I saw the source there. My next favourite will be the water intake at the bottom of the block, below both the pump, timing and ancillary belt. Perhaps a failed gasket there, I hope! Better still a perished durite hose or clip! Though the fact that warm air gave up from the air con prior to this episode means the heater matrix can't be ruled out, and I know they were pretty bad on the 407s. I'm looking at the picture on another thread of a suspect pipe, and mine is a reasonably early c6, which would fit the pattern, but for the life of me I can't wrap my head around where exactly I'm supposed to be peering to get a visual on this! Gmerry (if you're still reading!) are you taking that picture through the wheel arch, looking past a potentimeter with a drive shaft gaiter visible, or am I way off? Which side? I have looked in past both wheels but I see nothing immediately apparent and obvious as that distinctive looking pipe with some sort of cover you have circled. Is it, by any chance, part 6466 HA, with bracket still attached? Will, of course, share any new findings with the community. Thanks again, Nick |
||
|
|
|
||
|
nickyg
|
|
||
|
Member No: #100
Location: Tyrone |
Hello again folks, An update on this issue, I got into a proper pit, removed full undertray and was able to get an eye up past the alternator and glimpse the water/coolant intake, which is situated sort of "round the corner" from the water pump and pulley. There was a fair amount of water coming from it when at operating temperature, and am 90% certain a failed gasket/o-ring or intake unit here is the culprit. Also, my previous theory about residual LDS from the now fixed slow leak being in and about the various gubbins was correct. The washout of LDS with the coolant -and then distilled water- would no doubt give a confusing orange, oily sheen to the residues evidenced on the ground! From what I understand, the water pump, though in the vicinity, is further up the chain sucking water through the intake. Therefore, I can't fathom said pump contributing to the source of the leak ( I think it is the nearest part on the same vertical plane which could possibly allow water to gravitate to the aforementioned intake, and give me a false impression). The good news is a gasket is £1.50 and a new intake "port" is £20. The bad news is it is extraordinarily difficult to access readily! It seems the bumper, fans and radiator may have to come out, but will have a peek in deep behind the drivers wheel arch liner again.. not holding out hope for that, though. Hopefully I will be able to get my hands forced up past the alternator to release the single screw and hose coupling, change gasket and test for success. I am also going to ring Citroen and see what price I can bargain them into changing the intake parts and nearby waterpump parts if I pay for a fixed price timing belt change from them, due to the fact that there may be a very substantial crossover in terms of labour times. I would like to start thinking about the timing belt being changed anyway, and at that price I wouldn't entertain notions of immersing myself in such a job, and the items needed to perform it correctly Cheers, Nicky |
||
|
|
|
||
|
cruiserphil
|
|
||
 Member No: #38
Location: Celbridge |
Nicky, Tha air con compressor and alternator are not that difficult to move out of the way if that helps and gets you out of removing bumper etc. as you have described. There is enough play on the air con compressor hoses to move it out of the way and then the alternator is handy enough to remove altogether. This may give you the access you want. You will need to work from under the cat though! Regards, Phil C. |
||
|
|
|
||
|
gmerry
|
|
||
|
Member No: #21
Location: Scotland |
Hi, would a really strong solution of fluorescine dye help you spot the leaking joint (or waterpump seal)? You might also want to google the Jaguar websites, see if anyone there reports any water leak problems. I think the front (side for us) end of the engine is identical in that installation. Regards G |
||
|
|
|
||
|
nickyg
|
|
||
|
Member No: #100
Location: Tyrone |
Hi gerry, yes good idea. I had thought something along those lines, but the leak was so apparent when I got the undertray off that, to me, it simply must be the gasket/o- ring of the intake part (or crack in that part). The only other possible nearby source otherwise would be the pump. I'm getting at this tonight if I can get home before 7 for a change. Citroen and Peugeot (tried both) want £7 for the oring (pack of 4!) so am going to remove the part and match it up if possible in an auto store. With much googling I was able to determine the dimensions to be 55mm diameter by 30mm width. There are none in stock at the dealers in any event, have to order them in. Ps. You are right in that all Peugeot 2.7 hdi cars have the same set up in terms of this intake part. Had a search for landrover faults similar (not much joy) but not jag. Must have a look. I would have thought the 407 would be the best bet for info, though, but can't see much in that regard either. Will keep the forum posted on my findings. Cheers, Nicky |
||
|
|
|
||
|
gmerry
|
|
||
|
Member No: #21
Location: Scotland |
Hi Nickyg. I think the Landrover engine front end is different because that application used a viscous engine driven cooling fan, plus different sump and seals. £7 for the correct gasket/O ring sounds pretty cheap compared to doing the job twice! Remember to use EPDM elastomer seals if using non OEM. Regards G |
||
|
|
|
||
|
nickyg
|
|
||
|
Member No: #100
Location: Tyrone |
Yes, I noted the differences in the Landrover 2.7s. Quite dissimilar in fact. I was surprised, however, that a quick search with the relevant part numbers and names didn't direct me immediately to the 407 forums. I don't plan on doing the job twice (something I detest!). When I get the oring from behind the intake I'll shoot on with it in hand and have it matched up if it is (as is likely) a generic size. If no joy with an identical aftermarket match, no loss, as Citroen/Peugeot didn't have the part to hand for me right now anyway, and I need to get a close look at the plastic intake for cracks in any event before ordering in, in case I need that aswell.. so will await the part(s) from them before resealing the coolant system (just the once!)
|
||
|
|
|
||
|
gmerry
|
|
||
|
Member No: #21
Location: Scotland |
Nickyg, you probably have the job done by now, but was it the plastic pump intake housing or the O ring which was causing the leak. Regards G 
|
||
|
|
|
||
Go to page >>
|
|
 User Colour Key:Head Administrator, Administrator, C6 owner, Technical Expert, C6 Premier Discount Club |
|
Privacy Policy | Cookie Policy | Site Disclaimer | Contact Details | Warranty | Sitemap | C6 Insurance | Quick Facts | Re Call Info | Downloads | Error Codes
| Site and Graphics created by: C6Dave Forum Icons by Axialis Emotes by Seb | 
|
