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starting problems again |
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ststech
 
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    Member No: #1845
Location: CREWKERNE somerset |
tried it tonight it was so slow it was like it was being powered by a watch battery! took ages to start it eventualy started eml on engine fault and was misfiring switched off restarted ran smooth but eml stil lit i know when i plug into lexia to confirm and clear codes it will show one of the injectors it used to be inj 4 now its 3 has mind of its own battery is brand new! here is what lexia threw up last time it failed to start although turning faster but i dont think fast enough it was turning over faster this time P0203 : Injector 3 Characterisation : OC / Piezo discharged Status : Permanent fault Location : local . Variables associated with the fault Engine speed : 64 rpm engine torque : 346 engine coolant temperature : 13 °C battery voltage : 12 Volt(s) engine status : 02 time elapsed since ignition positive : 27 s diesel temperature : -38 °C main injection time : 037.33 ms BOITEVIT : gearbox Response data R61FE00000000305617020700050006170207FE02000001621520 R61FE00000000305617020700050006170207FE02000001621520 State of the ECU: BVA_AM6 Reference 1 : 621520 Reference 2 : Faults present : 1 U1208 : fault in the information transmitted by the engine ECU Characterisation : incorrect value received Status : Permanent fault Location : distant . Variables associated with the fault Converter status : not locked up or open Gear engaged : released Changing gear : No gearbox oil temperature : 018 °C battery voltage : 11.20 Volt(s) gearbox input speed (Turbine) : 0704 Rpm gearbox output speed : 0000 Rpm Engine speed : 0800 Rpm Actual engine torque : 027 Nm accelerator pedal position : 000 % Torque reduction requested by the automatic gearbox : 612 Nm |
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Tjensen
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  Member No: #954
Location: Bergen |
Low voltage can generate all kind of error messages. Have you fully charged the battery and then tested voltage under load/Starting ? | ||
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ststech
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Member No: #1845
Location: CREWKERNE somerset |
the battery is new and was charged fully the day i bought it prior to fitting it i have used the car a fair bit but since leaving itfor a day or so this has occured again barely turning over i could pull start a lawn mower faster but even when it has its ok moments and turning faster some days when left it is a pig to start it has all new glow plugs new battery i am now looking into starter replacement which isnt cheap prices vary from £180 to £1800 !!! |
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ststech
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Member No: #1845
Location: CREWKERNE somerset |
i would like to add that the car doesnt often turn as fast as i think it should certainly not like my c4 picasso hdi but it is far worse when left for a while to go cold and every now this extremly poor cranking speed pops up |
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e3steve
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 Member No: #1163
Location: Warsash, Hants & Palma de Mallorca, Spain |
I have similar issues with my 2.7HDi, but it doesn't throw the EML or any errors. It does, though, cause the RT3 to restart occasionally. I've spoken to my starter/alternator repairer; he has a starter motor testing rig for all types, so I'm going to remove it next week and take it to him. I suspect it's either a brushes issue -- there are four, mounted in an assembly, in order to apply the high inrush-current to the commutator -- or stator/rotor breaking down. I did get a Bosch rebuilt motor from a seller on eBay, but it was the wrong one. The 2.7 has a Denso device; the Bosch seems to be for the 2.2 engine. The seller has it listed for the 2.7, the 3.0 and the petrol engine. Wrong! I'll keep you all informed as to the outcome... |
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ststech
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Member No: #1845
Location: CREWKERNE somerset |
well i went out first thing this morning set my phone to video record under bonnet hoping to catch it on video to post here put key in car fired up first time grrrrrrr left car for about 3 hours went to start again it cranked over fairly quick not sure if quick enough but would not fire! i had to crank a few seconds pause and repeat this several times then it eventualy started no eml but i know if i had continualy cranked it then it would have thrown eml and injector fault i did last night clear the eml and stored codes after its episode of turning as fast as microwave turntable! and got inj 1 3 and 4 error another thing it has done a couple times is the rt3 restarting throwing up abs fault handbrake fault and anything it feels like these bring the abs service light on but then clear although faults are logged last time it was rear right speed sensor now its front left speed sensor that i cleared last night also is it normal for a bit of steam white smoke on cold start which clears after a few minutes notice it in this cold damp mornings but my c5 hdi 1.6 used to do the same but never had any other problems with it i do often see other cars petrol and diesel with this steam smoke visible for first few minutes from cold so not sure what it is intermittent extremely low crank speed failing to start its like car and starter has mind of its own as i said previous it has brand new varta battery and all 6 glow plugs im pulling my hair out hear now the bit i have left !! question is could the starter be the cause of all these issues or am i looking in wrong place i have a good used starter on its way to me not sure how easy it is to change but such as life  i realy love the car and dont want to have to get rid of it i waited ages to get one now i have one with more gremlins than in both films |
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speedfix
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  Member No: #1043
Location: south west |
IMO the car has low battery voltage! need to do some live data tests to confirm. The starter motor how you describe it is not getting to its correct cranking speed To confirm a failing starter do a current draw test, live data amps. IMO so far both my C6s do not put out any visible smoke steam on start up. Could be injector leakage fault or water in combustion chamber on one cylinder. Testing battery volts on my cars after being stationery one for two weeks 12v one stationery 12hours 12.6volts for what its worth, original batteries. Below 12volts can cause all sorts of problems as has been mentioned. A failed diode can cause battery drain but would show up with lexia etc. |
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ststech
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Member No: #1845
Location: CREWKERNE somerset |
the battery is 3 week old a varta h3 so i think can rule battery out as a week before that i had same problem with a battery bought from halfords which i took back and replaced with an h3 | ||
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ststech
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Member No: #1845
Location: CREWKERNE somerset |
i took a couple videos tonight it turned over a little faster than last night when it was as fast as a microwave turntable and no steam smoke tonight so i put that down to unburnt fuel as it threw up 3 injector faults last night here are 2 videos of it starting judge for yourself - Click Here - - Click Here - |
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e3steve
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Member No: #1163
Location: Warsash, Hants & Palma de Mallorca, Spain |
Simon, Re: your videos, Mine sounds just the same. Rgds, Steve |
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speedfix
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Member No: #1043
Location: south west |
IMO if you have a fully charged battery and a cranking speed like the above video then the starter is the problem. Note after a short period the starter speed drops to almost a speed that will in effect be not enough to start the engine on a frosty morning. I would also have reservations about the car being left for days without being started that the injector if leaking will cause hydraulicing of the cylinder involved causing other probs. |
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ststech
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Member No: #1845
Location: CREWKERNE somerset |
this was this mornings attempt to start please bear in mind sometimes i have to crank 4 or 5 times and sometimes the cranking speed is a quarter of this and now i remember it when its warm it cranks at the same speed as this video - Click Here - |
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e3steve
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Member No: #1163
Location: Warsash, Hants & Palma de Mallorca, Spain |
I'm glad mine isn't the only 2.7 with noisy hydraulic tappets until the oil pressure is up! | ||
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cruiserphil
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  Member No: #38
Location: Celbridge |
Simon, Your starter sounds a little laboured! Regards, Phil C. |
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ststech
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Member No: #1845
Location: CREWKERNE somerset |
going to change starter tomorrow but i have been out and tried to undo the fuel filter housing undone all bolts i could see on top and side but it will not budge has anyone any idea how to remove the housing regards Simon |
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