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Suspension problems
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smihaialex   
Thu Oct 17 2013, 10:07am
Joined: Sep 18 2012
Member No: #1031
Location: Bucharest
 Hey G,

Thanks for the advice, I will not replace the multi-functional command unit for now

Hey Rog, hey Steve,

I was up to speed with what had happened to you guys, so I checked the maxi fuse first (it's the one located underneath the fuse unit, right?!?), but unfortunately, it's not that Current reaches the pump ok, but it doesn't do anything - it seems that it's not the pump itself (the electrical motor), but the embedded electronic command unit...

I also checked the fluid level and, despite the oily marks on my left hand side tyre and wheel arch lining, the LDS seems to be all there (I can't use the suspension commands to lay the car down flat on its belly - they don't work anymore, but it's pretty flat at the front end, and the LDS amost reaches the flat part of the tank, so if some is missing, it's a tiny amount).

I will check out the website and get in touch with BBA reman to see if I can source a reconditioned pump there, and possibly trade in my old unit for an additional discount, thank you very much

Hey Rory,

I don't know about the eBay approach man... You see, so far I've only repaired my C6 using brand new OEM parts, and I feel somewhat uncomfortable breaking that streak (even though it has cost me a small fortune - I'm not going to say how much, but I will say that I could have bought another used C6, comfortably). However, I will check it out and if it's a real bargain, maybe I'll give it a shot

Thank you very much guys.

Keep you posted,
Sam
smihaialex   
Thu Oct 17 2013, 02:54pm
Joined: Sep 18 2012
Member No: #1031
Location: Bucharest
 Found this on eBay - Click Here - but I don't exactly know how to verify if it's a match with my car... The supplied manufacturer code 9654068680 doesn't look like a Citroen Service reference to the HP Pump which for my car is 5277G2, 5277G3 or 5277L7.

Any ideas?!?

Thanks,
Sam

PS: I've also contacted BBA Reman, and unfortunately they don't have this in stock right now. They did offer me the option of sending them my unit, but it would cost me £185 if they don't fix it and £425 if they do (£150 shipping to and from UK, £35 evaluation fee payable only if they don't fix it, £275 if they do fix it).
C6Dave   
Thu Oct 17 2013, 03:31pm

Joined: Oct 01 2009
Member No: #1
Location: Northumberland
 Sam 9654068680 doesn't match any Peugeot numbers either - the format does look like the new way that Pug use them, but that doesn't match any vehicle so must be a wrong number?

They have probably just copied it off one of the labels and it's a suppliers number
Website
speedfix   
Thu Oct 17 2013, 05:38pm
Joined: Sep 28 2012
Member No: #1043
Location: south west
 Are you sure its not a strut failure and the command to pump has shut down?
Just a though!
I will read the thread when not so busy.
adam   
Thu Oct 17 2013, 08:18pm
Joined: Aug 25 2012
Member No: #999
Location: Birkenhead
adam wrote ...

Hi recently my suspension has started to drop at the rear immediately after switching the engine off. Also the engine has to be running before the suspension comes back up to the correct level rather than when just "bliping" with the keys. I know that there is a fault and will have to book the car into the dealer, but my questions are:
1 Is this going to be expensive to fix?
2 Is the car safe to drive?
3 Will drive damage the car further

Thanks
Adam
cruiserphil   
Thu Oct 17 2013, 08:29pm

Joined: Jan 24 2010
Member No: #38
Location: Celbridge
 Adam,

Did you not check out my reply to your original post?

Regards,

Phil C.
smihaialex   
Thu Oct 17 2013, 10:32pm
Joined: Sep 18 2012
Member No: #1031
Location: Bucharest
 Hey guys,

@Dave,

I think the guy over on eBay just copied off the code on the pump, which is the bar code serial number, not the part reference number. i don't thing that the parte reference number is going to be present on the pump itself, but the real question is: is there way to cross reference the serial numbers and the part numbers? If there is, I'm sure Citroen know about it, so I wrote them... Hopefully they'll answer soon

@speedfix,

I've been asking ppl around, both here, as well as at the service and no one seems to be sure that such a mechanism exists - a mechanism that shuts off the pump when a hidraulic failure occurs...

Do you know of such a mechanism - strut or sphere failure shuts down the pump?!?

I ask because indeed, to me it seemed like the failure of the front left hand side strut or sphere (or both) - hypothesis which would also explain the LDS fluid spill on the front left tyre and wheel arch lining.

But so far no one has confirmed the existence of such a mechanism and people over at the service shop say that regardless of the failure of the strut or sphere (or both), the pump should run.

Any comments, ideas & suggestions are more than welcome

Thanks,
Sam

PS: further more, because the pump does not run and the car sits flat on its nose, they can't lift it up on an elevator to further investigate, so until the pump is replaced, I won't know the entire magnitude of the damage... It's close to £2,000 so far, but if I have to also replace the spheres, it might get as high as just over £3,000... God forbid I also have to replace the front struts
speedfix   
Fri Oct 18 2013, 07:13am
Joined: Sep 28 2012
Member No: #1043
Location: south west
 Just a thought, could you first get a test on the n/s sphere for nitrogen pressure as I suspect a catastrophic failure of the diaphram, this could send a pressure wave, the first of the effect IMO would be the strut.Then----------!?
Maybe Gmerry could confirm.
gmerry   
Fri Oct 18 2013, 07:56am
Joined: Dec 11 2009
Member No: #21
Location: Scotland
 Seems to me that the front of the car needs to be raised, the pressure bled off via the bleed screws and spheres removed and checked, hydraulic module/pump replaced and Lexia hooked up - generally in that order.

Failure of a sphere and subsequent loss of volume of LDS (385ml of LDS will flood the sphere volume) and release of nitrogen gas/bubbles into the system is somethat that the hydraulics should cope with. I have seen this as gush of dirty brown fluid at the tank filler (LDS full of nitrogen bubbles). The spheres have spikes purposely placed to rupture a [flat] sphere so presumably the hydraulic system was designed for all of this??????.

Like all of us, I would like to know what was the underlying root cause of the hydraulic module/pump failure. Generally ECUs don't die unless stressed in some way or subject to extreme environment (corrosive fluid, leaks etc)

Regards
G

PS, from a safety perspective it seems a bit worrying to me that the service shop is proposing to first replace the hydraulics and then raise the car - without any mention of confirming that all pressure has been bled off. If this can't be done via Lexia, there are bleed screws on the front and rear ride stiffness regulators. The +front
smihaialex   
Fri Oct 18 2013, 09:51pm
Joined: Sep 18 2012
Member No: #1031
Location: Bucharest
 Thanks G!

So, let me get this straight, your approach would be to first bleed the circuit, then remove the spheres, and check the struts, and only then replace the pump...

The only problem here is that they can't reach underneath the car, to bleed the circuit, because the car is too low and can't be taken up on an elevator, and my service shop doesn't feature one of those trench type holes in the pavement allowing you to work under the car without it being raised...

Thanks,
Sam
smihaialex   
Sat Oct 19 2013, 03:15pm
Joined: Sep 18 2012
Member No: #1031
Location: Bucharest
 @Rog & @Steve,

Hey guys, one question - when your pump maxi fuse blew out, what happened to the car and its suspension - did it drop at the front? Did it drop at the back? Did it drop alltogether, or did it remain as it was when the fuse blew?!?

Also, if you hit the suspension buttons (up/down) what happened?!? I imagine there's no way for it to get higher, but what about lower? And what did it display on screen - was the suspension faulty error message brought up?!? Did it display Command dissallowed when fiddling with the control buttons?!?

Thank you soo much,
Sam
Trainman   
Sat Oct 19 2013, 03:36pm

Joined: Apr 12 2010
Member No: #86
Location: Penwortham
smihaialex wrote ...

The only problem here is that they can't reach underneath the car, to bleed the circuit, because the car is too low and can't be taken up on an elevator, and my service shop doesn't feature one of those trench type holes in the pavement allowing you to work under the car without it being raised...

Thanks,
Sam


I don't have access to a "pit" or Lift, Want I had to do my old C5 was to use a series of jacks, Scissor jack, small Hydraulic, Large Hydraulic and the put ramps underneath it get the right height and support, Its a pian to do but at least it's an option.
rogerandoutman   
Sat Oct 19 2013, 04:22pm
Joined: May 10 2011
Member No: #466
Location: London
 My c6 did not drop when suspension faulty message appeared, but driving on the motorway the car pitched up and down like a conventional car with failed shock absorbers. The car felt as if it had no damping.
Don't want to speak to soon but my pump with the 50amp fuse appears to be behaving normally. The pump operates when the car is unlocked and the ride height adjusts either up or down
e3steve   
Sun Oct 20 2013, 02:19pm
Joined: Jan 21 2013
Member No: #1163
Location: Warsash, Hants & Palma de Mallorca, Spain
 Mine did pretty much the same as rog's. It happened, the first time, as I left east of Southampton for a drive to Poole -- a 47-mile (+/- 76km) trip, each way -- and the display warned as shown in the image herewith.

It drove fine all the way there but was pretty uncomfortable for the return drive!

Thankfully, the Hydractive systems differ from the oleo-pneumatics of my older GSX2, DS, CX & BXs; they would all have been impossible to continue being driven, having not only no suspension, but also no PAS (GS notwithstanding) or brakes!!
smihaialex   
Sun Oct 20 2013, 09:41pm
Joined: Sep 18 2012
Member No: #1031
Location: Bucharest
 Yes! That's the exact message that I was shown on my display (and coincidentally, we also use the same colour scheme)

However, unlike your experiences, my car drove perfectly for the couple of miles between the error showing up and my parking - I couldn't notice any difference whatsoever at that time. However, things changed over night - the next day, the car was low and the suspension was crazy stiff...

Cheers,
Sam
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